Paul Witteman just can’t hide his contempt for Frans Bauer. The presenter sneered in an interview that he never really wanted to interview the folk singer at all.
For years, Paul Witteman together with Jeroen Pauw made the most important late talk show in the Netherlands: Pauw & Witteman. There was a commotion at the end of 2009 when Frans Bauer joined them. He talked about being involved in his own shows. “For example, I know how many wheelchairs I have in my theatre. That sounds strange, but I know that.”
More than half
Frans was then surprised by a particularly insensitive comment from Paul: “Is that more than half?”
It struck a nerve with Frans. “No, that’s not… I don’t like it either, by the way. I don’t like that you say that, because I think people with disabilities should be able to go to a concert in the same way.”
Paul then: “It was absolutely not intended that way. If so, I offer my apologies.”
Faux pas
Six months later, Paul acknowledged that this was not convenient of him. “Yes, that’s called a faux pas in French. You try to be witty, especially when it comes to this type of conversation where the transfer of information is not the most important thing, but you have to have it a bit for the atmosphere. Sometimes things go wrong and this is an excellent example of that.”
Was Frans really touched or was it a smart reaction? “I think smart. The suggestion put forward by his hurt is that I discriminate against disabled people or something. That was not my intention at all. It was at most a bit witty that I wanted to say: ‘If you go to Frans Bauer then…’ Huh?”
Then you must be disabled? “Well, that wasn’t fun either.”
Another sneer
Now Paul throws another sneer at Frans. He looks in Never sleep again back to how entertainment ‘creeped in’ at Pauw & Witteman. “This was preceded by lively discussions between Jeroen and me. Jeroen was also a bit of the light work and I was always afraid that terrible music was played. There was discussion about it.”
Terrible music by Frans for example. “The announcement that we were allowed to make the talk show on the condition that it was for a wide audience, of course, had repercussions on our choice of repertoire. There’s no denying that. I agree with that, but it’s not really journalism. Inviting Bauer is not journalism.”
‘Not my mentality’
Host Pieter van der Wielen: “Well, it does offer a window on the world. I think that’s kind of a form of journalism.”
Paul: “If you invite Bauer to sing a song?!”
Pieter: “Well, not if he wants to sing a song…”
Paul: “That’s his job!”
Pieter: “If you have a conversation with Frans Bauer, it is indeed light journalism, but: yes, you offer a window on the world.”
Paul: “I think you’re right, but I don’t have the right mentality for that.”
sorry
In retrospect, Paul regrets that he has chatted with this kind of celebrities for years. He points to the success of his last show: Podium Witteman. “If you make such a program and it also costs quite a bit of money and the leadership of the NPO is very enthusiastic, then you think: why have I been chasing those ratings so much all these years?”
Pieter: “From: why did I let Frans Bauer in if I could have just talked about Bach?”
Paul jokingly: “My colleagues must have been behind this. There is no other way.”
Pieter: “You didn’t call him yourself?”
Paul: “No, haha.”
Fragment
The collision between Frans and Paul at the time: