Simon Ungless has just returned to San Francisco after a residency at Atelier Jolie — the new New York fashion company founded by Angelina Jolie to promote artisanal crafts. He’s busy working on the clothes for his upcoming show during El Paseo Fashion Week.
In 2020, he founded his passion project When Simon Met Ralph while continuing to teach full-time. The origin of the name is indicative of Ungless’s artistic process of serendipity: Early on, someone inquired about the name of his burgeoning brand, he looked down at himself, saw that he was wearing a Ralph Lauren polo shirt, and replied, “When.” Simon Met Ralph.”
This informality reflects the essence of punk and the DIY aesthetic that has been present in Ungless’ work since his early days, when, penniless and brimming with creativity, he collaborated with his friend, the late designer Alexander McQueen, to design his runway collections in a backyard to design in South London.
Things came full circle recently when Ungless was invited back to McQueen last year to collaborate with Sarah Burton on her final collection for the fashion house. FashionUnited was able to spend some time with Ungless to talk to him about his return to the industry after 25 years building and leading the fashion program at the Academy of Art University, and to get some insight into his exciting new projects.
What is the motivation behind When Simon Met Ralph?
I think it was when I moved to California in the late ’90s and started learning about sustainability and conscious design, but in a fundamental way. I was thinking about how I could make my clothes last longer and I was aware of how many things I was buying. From one day to the next I changed my mind and thought about why I shouldn’t fold up the polo shirt that I had already worn a few times and people had already seen and cover it with resin or latex, or whether I shouldn’t put it in Put it outside for half a year to see what the sun does to the color. That was actually the beginning.
How did your artistic process evolve from there?
It was about how to stop people from shopping and more about going through our closets and “rehabilitating” items to see how we can get more life out of the clothes. I’m in a lucky position because I have experience in it thanks to my work and of course the McQueen thing really helps. I recently refurbished two of her husband’s shirts for a customer and now he loves the shirts again, but it’s also like they have a piece of my art.
Where do you get your clothes from?
For almost 40 years, I have collected a huge archive that I have integrated into my work. I try to be really intentional and look for maybe two days a week. I go to estate sales and have a few thrift stores that I go to and people give me stuff all the time, plus a few resources in the industry. When I go somewhere, I plan my route so that I can shop there because I don’t want to increase my carbon footprint even further. There’s an incredible little shop nearby on the Russian River, and the staff message me when they have something they know might be interesting. I don’t buy mass-produced items, only individual items, so I don’t try to find ten ball gowns online, for example. I don’t want to get into production.
How did you come across Atelier Jolie?
Angelina found me on Instagram and I think she liked my work. We have a similar aesthetic and I think she liked the fact that I was in teaching but also knew I was a bit of a troublemaker. We met for the first time via Zoom and I felt like I had just spent an hour chatting with an old school friend. But Atelier Jolie is very much her; it is their plan, it is their project. It’s not a license and it’s not about production. It’s not about profit. It’s about a different way of being and hopefully at the end of the day we can help people through knowledge. It’s not about creating the next big brand, but more about preventing that, if at all. That’s why I said ‘yes’.
During your time at Atelier Jolie, you repurposed pieces from the closets of New Yorkers who brought their clothes into the store. How was it?
I felt like I was coming full circle to art again. This is all connected to why I went into teaching, but also to why I left it, and connects my creativity to what Atelier Jolie hopes to achieve. It’s about bringing art back into fashion, something that was maybe more common a few decades ago and what originally attracted me to fashion, but it’s kind of disappeared from the industry. Maybe I’m very naive to think that I can help bring some of this back, but it seems to strike a chord. My work was already dealing with this topic before the studio, but the events came together perfectly. Years ago I heard Lee say: I’m here to destroy the industry from within. And that always stayed with me. I can understand that. Something needs to be changed, if not destroyed.
Have your sources of inspiration changed since the time you spent working in McQueen’s Backyard?
No, not at all. The things I’ve been obsessed with since I was a kid, I’m still obsessed with. For example, when I first saw pictures of the Tollund Man, I was completely obsessed, and I have a dress sitting on my printing table right now that I think might have been worn by the Tollund Man’s wife, if she took LSD in the 1970s. I always have to tell a story when I work, a person or a story. And that’s why I like working with used clothing so much, because I can build a story very quickly.
Are you looking for a retail space or do you want to open more stores?
I’ve always been very against going into stores with what I do, so I sold online and directly to consumers, but it’s so difficult. I spend more time dealing with weirdos than people trying to buy, and I’ve had to shut out a few people. I’m not super expensive, but I can’t sell items for $25, and I don’t do “buy one, get one free” or anything like that. I’ve turned down some really great retail offers in the past because I didn’t want to go that route.
But the studio works for me because, although the clothes are for sale, they are also an example of what can be done with the resources available on the ground floor. People can come in and get a little inspiration, then they can take off their coat, put it on the printing table and print it on the spot. It’s this free exchange of ideas. There’s nothing better than when someone who has no experience with fashion comes here and has that experience. It’s great to be generous and share this information. That’s what I want. That’s why I think the studio works for me, and maybe a few other shops, other locations. If I get the opportunity to continue participating in the studio, I would love to see where it goes.
You mentioned prices, could you provide a price range for your pieces?
It’s really a wide range. Some pieces I got are very special and took me a lot of time. For example, in the studio there is a really great Romeo Gigli suit from the late 80s, which I grabbed. It’s $2,000, which I think is reasonable for this particular piece, but then I have sweatshirts that are $250 to $300, and then there are prices in between depending on the piece and the work that goes into it. I might have a coat sitting on my printing table for a week, working on it. I don’t want to sound arrogant, but people are willing to spend hundreds of dollars for an evening, but when you buy something I worked on, you are buying a piece of art and history. A moment of history.
How does it feel to be working in the industry again on your own after so many years in teaching?
Since leaving the academy I have had one project after another, all very different, be it an exhibition, collaborating on a chapter for a book, and I still have a few university commitments. But the break was absolutely necessary. Over the last few years I’ve been at the academy, I’ve been traveling more to international schools, and I’ve started to see everything I hate about teaching, or more specifically, people who work in it, without a solid one Have industry background or experience. The boardroom sucks you dry and I felt completely burnt out.
After the pandemic, I had to live by my own rules and get back to what I do, with a few small part-time jobs as a visiting professor, a small consulting job at a local vocational school, so I could still gain experience working with students. I realized that maybe I still had something in me, but not full-time. I have something to give again, and my own work fills me up, and then I can be generous when I want to give back. Honestly, I had the best year and a half. Collaborating with Sarah on this exhibition REBEL 30 Years of London Fashion at the Design Museum, which ended in February and was curated by Sarah Burton) was a gift. I was there at the beginning and the end because it’s the end of our collaboration with McQueen. It’s a completely different story now.
This article originally appeared on FashionUnited.uk. Translated and edited by Simone Preuss.