‘There is a haze of mystery surrounding the whole Schubert,’ concludes presenter Gijs Groenteman in his characteristic drawling tone in the 25-part podcast. On a winter trip with Oliemans and Groenteman. Together with baritone and connoisseur Thomas Oliemans, Groenteman dives armpit deep into Schubert’s song cycle winter trip, one of the most beloved works in the classical repertoire. Without being able to completely remove the haze, by the way – and that’s fine. The series is a run-up to the solo recital that Oliemans will give on 22 March in the Recital Hall of the Concertgebouw, where he will accompany himself at the piano in the integral winter trip – exactly as Schubert himself did, but nowadays unique.
On Winterreise is a spin-off of the podcast Talking about music that Groenteman is making for the Concertgebouw with musicologist Thomas de Jonker, who is also now participating in the discussion. De Jonker (Groenteman consistently calls him ‘little Thomas’) confesses that he had never listened to Winterreise “until a month ago” – refreshingly honest and no problem, because he has his research in order. De Jonker concludes with satisfaction that “the ladies and gentlemen of the analysts” also cannot figure out what the situation is with the Winterreise. There is no unambiguous reading of the cycle and that is precisely its strength.
The three talk about Wilhelm Müller’s poems and about the intimate setting in which Schubert first performed the ‘schauerliche Lieder’ to his friends. About the way in which he connected the songs and thus “composed the silences too.” And about the article: should there really be ‘Die’ for Winterreise? Does the cycle have a story and why do we expect it? Was Schubert an unsung genius or is that a romantic cliché? Is heartbreak a form of grief?
Marathon talk
Oliemans gives insightful analyzes of text and music to the piano, enthusiastically avoiding or disproving romantic clichés. Groenteman excels in earthly formulations with which he succinctly summarizes the core of Oliemans’ character interpretations. About ‘Die Wetterfahne’: “You raise your fuck finger, you turn around and you collapse again.”
The 25 parts are actually a six-hour marathon conversation. It sometimes goes a bit off the bat, but the pace is good and the stories and anecdotes are almost continuously entertaining. The Thomases in particular sometimes go against each other. At the end of the introductory first episode, Groenteman intervenes: “For God’s sake, let’s not argue, we still have 24 songs to go through.”