Hi Noël, what is the main item on the agenda at this G20 summit?
‘Actually, this summit should be about how we can boost the economy after the corona crisis and how we can make a transition to a green economy. But in practice it is about only one subject: the war in Ukraine. It overshadows everything.
“The major Western countries want to isolate Russia at this summit. They are mainly concerned with convincing the doubters. Today, for example, Prime Minister Mark Rutte, who is a guest at the G20 summit, had a one-on-one conversation with Chinese President Xi Jinping. In it, Rutte, as he himself called it, tried to encourage Xi to take sides.
‘Besides that geopolitical game, the conversations also concern food security, a consequence of the war. So has the Indonesian instant noodle-industry problems: the grain for the noodles comes from Ukraine and the fertilizer for the paddy fields comes from Russia. Even if it is a distant war, its consequences are also noticeable here.’
Russian President Vladimir Putin did not travel to Bali himself, but sent his foreign minister, Sergei Lavrov. How does that affect the atmosphere?
“It’s Lavrov against the rest. I am not there myself, but Rutte said today that the Russian minister is a rude figure. Before Lavrov flew here, he said this G20 summit should be about socio-economic issues, not law and order. According to him, we have the UN Security Council for that.
‘It may be a pity that world leaders are not talking about economic progress now, Rutte also said, but all cooperation and development takes place in this context. There’s just someone sitting in the conference room who started a war. He’s being scolded now.’
Will the participating countries issue a joint statement tomorrow?
‘The sub-meetings earlier this year yielded nothing, but observers say that a statement may be issued tomorrow condemning the war in Ukraine. That is quite different from the hoped-for agreement about the transition to green energy or the phasing out of coal.
Most world leaders have not seen each other for years due to the corona crisis. Now they suddenly see each other three times a week. Last weekend was the meeting of ASEAN, an organization of ten countries in Southeast Asia, which also included China, Japan and the United States. The main participants then flew on to Bali for the summit that is now taking place. And then the whole bups have to quickly go back to Bangkok, where a summit of the Apec, the organization of countries around the Pacific and Indian Ocean, will start on Friday.’
Host country Indonesia has ambitious economic plans for the future, you wrote earlier. Does the G20 summit also live among the people of Bali?
‘No, people here are busy with completely different things. If you ask them about it, they will say at most: it is good for Bali, because tourists are coming again and we have work again. The corona time has been tough here. There was no financial compensation. Many people have returned to their parents’ village to work on the palm plantations or rice fields again. The tourism sector, the most important sector in Bali, was at a loss.
The island is upside down. Eighteen thousand soldiers and ten thousand police officers have come to Bali from all over the country. You wonder if there are any cops left in the rest of Indonesia. You see armored cars driving, soldiers in black uniforms go on dirt bikes through the streets and snipers walk around between the bathers. Off the coast is half the fleet: I saw six naval ships in front of the hotel.
‘How the airspace is protected here says a lot about the pursuit of harmony in Indonesia. This is done by two American F16s and two Russian Sukhoi fighter jets. With this, the country wants to show that it does not take sides. Or as the Indonesians say themselves: they prefer to row between two reefs. In the United Nations, Indonesia has rejected the annexation of the Ukrainian provinces by Russia, but otherwise it tries to keep everyone on friendly terms.’
This G20 summit marks the start of your Southeast Asian correspondentship. How do you like that?
‘It was fascinating to write about Indonesia’s economic ambitions. I also find it interesting how this region may or may not show in the coming years that it can fend for itself and thus maintain its independence, avoiding the US or China calling the shots.
‘My place of employment during this correspondentship is Indonesia. I could also have lived in Bangkok or Hanoi, but the Netherlands has a shared history with Indonesia. Many topics still arise from that. For example, my next story will be about the celebration of Sinterklaas, who is protected here by believers of the local mosque. That says something about the polarization in society.’