THEThe audience enters the stage, a dazzlingly white space. He wanders freely between picture frames and the statue of a Venus-like figure. Suddenly, a voice: «We can begin!» proclaims Ida Marinelli. And everyone sits down. It begins like this, in “interactive” mode, The collectorwhich will be atElfo Puccini of Milan from January 9th to February 2nd. The direction is by Marco Lorenzithe text by Magdalena Barile, but the underlying idea belongs to the actress who is an icon of this theatre.
Ida Marinelli at Elfo con The collector
«A long time ago I read Peggy Guggenheim’s autobiography, A life for artand it was a surprise” explains Ida, in the offices of the company/cooperative which has been a beacon for contemporary drama for over fifty years. Her words contrasted with the image I had of her, that of a snobbish and unpleasant American billionaire , one that even profited from painters and sculptors in dire straits. It wasn’t true: it was rather some of them who took advantage, and the curious thing is that she was aware of it very well… I was very struck by discovering a woman who was also self-destructiveparticularly in relationships with men. She had been a rebellious child, very attached to her father, who she lost (she was 14) in the sinking of the Titanic, and to her sister, who died in childbirth. However, there was no point in telling her vicissitudes, she had done it – very well, frankly and without discounts – alone in the memoir. We needed a different perspective.”
How to tell Peggy Guggenheim
So what?
«Long story. Ferdinando (Ferdinando Bruni, co-founder of Elfo, ed.) and I found a little hole in Venice, we often visit the Peggy Guggenheim Collection: there I read a book about the three women who lived in Palazzo Venier dei Leoni (by Judith Mackrell, ed.) . The first was the Marchioness Luisa Casati Stampa, who had transformed it into a mythical place for parties, followed by the Viscountess Doris Castlerosse, an English social climber who sold it to the Guggenheim. I thought that the right approach was to create a “hybrid” character: a collector like Peggy, who however is called Doris and goes around with a lion like Luisa. And that somehow reminds me of me, as much as it embarrasses me to say it…”.
The actress will play the face of the famous patron Peggy Guggenheim in “The Collector”, at the Elfo Puccini Theater in Milan
A great closeness
Why does it embarrass her?
«When in the play she is asked: “What is art for you?”, she replies: “My life”. That’s my own response, I know it sounds “pompous”. And I would subscribe to another of his lines: “The biggest challenge is keeping this space open”, which in my case is the Elf. There is, in the background, the awareness that this is a person at the end of his existence, which agrees with me. (smiles) For goodness sake! We must accept things as they are! When you reach the age of almost 80 (I’m 77).”
We must congratulate you, even though it doesn’t comply with etiquette… Confess your secret!
«Take it philosophically? In 2022 I fell down the stairs, I had to remain immobile for four months, I couldn’t even read. I just listened to the pain (maybe it sounds ridiculous…). The women of my generation, who know how to be heroic, are used to overcoming difficulties by resisting, resisting, resisting. Maybe I even have a masochistic side.”
Resist difficulties
Even in love?
«My sentimental situations always reached a point where one, fascinated by what he saw from the outside, expected more than what I actually was and was left disappointed. A consideration that recalls Rita Hayworth’s phrase: «Men go to bed with Gilda and wake up with me»… Exactly. But I never cared: I’m happy to be the way I am, for me normality is a value. He didn’t choose a “normal” profession. Since I was little, my favorite game was my puppet theater. And with the neighborhood girls we had fun singing traditional songs, like the Donna Lombarda (she sings it), and “playing them out”. The atmosphere of the town helped.”
Ida Marinelli, 77 years old, on the scene of The Collector
The boss was a woman
What country was it?
«Avesa, three kilometers from Verona, famous for its washerwomen: thanks to a small river tributary of the Adige, the linen of hospitals, restaurants and hotels in the entire city was managed communally (a custom that dated back to the sixteenth century). The “bosses” were the women, an almost matriarchal society: I grew up in that atmosphere. In the evening they sat outside the houses and told stories, it was like a continuous play. In 1957, unfortunately, there was a setback in the family, everything ended up in ruins.”
And what happened to her?
«Straight to college. The nuns, having glimpsed something in me, forced me to take part in little shows. And singing: if I didn’t reach a high note, they locked me in a room until I could. Once outside, woe betide anyone who asked me to recite poetry! At 13 I had already had an artistic crisis! (laughs).”
Artistic passion
How did she get out of it?
«My father took me to see the A Midsummer Night’s DreamI fell in love again in an instant! There were Glauco Mauri, Valeria Moriconi, Corrado Pani who was the best, he was with Mina. After middle school dad thought about enrolling me in a course, too bad I asked him about acting and he chose singing. Oh well, in the end it was useful: at 15-16 years old they took me into the Arena choir. In the summer it was tiring: in the morning I woke up at five to go to the factory (after compulsory school I started working immediately), at the end of the shift I joined the cast of the opera. Not satisfied, I enrolled at the Conservatory…”
I don’t know how he managed it! When did you arrive in Milan?
«I think it was ’70: accompanied by my classmates from the factory, I came to take the exam for the Piccolo school. They took me, and the commute to Verona began. That’s when I met the Elves.”
Group photo for the members of the Teatro dell’Elfo. In addition to Ida Marinelli, we can recognize Gabriele Salvatores (with the hat), Ferdinando Bruni and Elio Capitani (leaning on the sides of the staircase).
The meeting with the Elves
How?
«Ferdinando was in the directors’ course and in the afternoon, while waiting for the return train, I stopped at those lessons. The Elfo was starting with (by the Brazilian Augusto Boal, ed.) and much of the credit goes to Gabriele Salvatores: he had had some money at the end of the Lyceum to buy a Cinquecento and instead had spent it on preparing this text. He had gone around looking for the interpreters (in addition to Ferdinando, Luca Toracca and Cristina Crippa who came from the Accademia dei Filodrammatici) and formed the initial nucleus. Which is still there.”
Why “Elf”?
«After a night spent racking their brains (Teatro Operaio? Or Teatro Officina?), they were exasperated. Ferdinand got annoyed and cut it short: “Let’s call him Elfo!”. It conveyed the idea of poor wretches who nevertheless possessed something magical.”
It was 1973, and you are still together. How did you resist, with what is whispered about the ego of artists?
«We supported each other: people who hadn’t wanted to start a family (I absolutely didn’t believe it) found it here. Every now and then someone protested: “Dear Elves, I can’t take it anymore! I’m leaving.” Yet something inevitably brought you back inside… After The Coffee Shop, in the 90s, I too was tempted to leave them: I had discovered that they wanted to offer my share to someone else… It would have been horrible, a professional and human failure: Ferdinando and I, who had been a couple, had now become brothers.”
Ida da Marinelli in The bitter tears of Petra von Kant, an iconic show of the Teatro dell’Elfo which debuted in November 1988
The most loved characters
Which characters in your gallery are you most attached to?
«To the protagonist of The bitter tears of Petra von Kant: We were coming out of a financially difficult period after that The servant by Robin Maugham and that show, in 1988, was an unexpected success: no one thought that bringing Fassbinder on stage was a good move.”
And beyond Petra?
«My favorite is Cassandra by Christa Wolf: the theme of family interests me, having had a complicated one. And the revisited Phaedra by Agnese Grieco, for which I was inspired by my mother, and her love for a younger man.”
Acting as a tool to work out tensions with your mother?
Yes, and she didn’t understand it. After seeing me in , he commented: “Idina, this Amanda is all your aunt!”. (laughs).”
The Elf is the realization of a dream
How did the Elves fare from a gender equality perspective?
«We shared everything, but who is the artistic director here? Not me! (they are Bruni and Elio De Capitani, ed.). (laughs). Jokes aside, there was constant attention: in ’81 we gave up on why one would get the line: “I’m your dog, love, I’ll be your cocker spaniel.” Some time later Gabriele proposed it again in the form of a musical, so it passed. The word “dream” is a part of our seasons. The Elf is the realization of a dream. Yes, that’s a bit of a nightmare sometimes. (smiles).”
And how did it end with the joke?
«I sang it, it was the role that interested me most with its contradictions, its nuances. Just like Peggy: a very strong and fragile soul.”
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